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Why doesn't Force have a projectile?
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FlamingMonkey



Joined: 30 Jul 2002
Posts: 8397

PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2004 10:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Why doesn't Force have a projectile? Reply with quote

Because you can counter just fast enough after the aRK landing to punish most of the game's fastest attacks. You can also LK right afterwards to pull back (while they swing and miss or try to counter a followup) then hit them in the face with the slow attack LK is.
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Vuen



Joined: 31 Aug 1999
Posts: 4968
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2004 11:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Why doesn't Force have a projectile? Reply with quote

But Jag's flk is easily faster than Force's landing cooldown! He gets to hit you with flk before you even get the chance to react, regardless of what you want to do.

I'd also really like to emphasis the fact that I played you only once, on your server, for only 7 rounds, with 90 ping Xar. It's not very fair for you to make an estimation of how predictable I am with these kind of conditions.

Anyway the point is a Force still can't be aggressive towards a Jaguar. That combined with its attack system focused on specials and low armor to boot means the Jaguar is infinitely better off in the stun department.
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Lurker



Joined: 26 May 2003
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 7:12 am    Post subject: Re: Why doesn't Force have a projectile? Reply with quote

Quote:
Anyway the point is a Force still can't be aggressive towards a Jaguar. That combined with its attack system focused on specials and low armor to boot means the Jaguar is infinitely better off in the stun department.


I disagree with this...

right Xar? Wink
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eengoedemorgen



Joined: 30 Aug 2002
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 8:14 am    Post subject: Re: Why doesn't Force have a projectile? Reply with quote

Yes, the old meteor calls were WAY better then the new ones.. especially cause you could use them multiple times in a combo, really usefull for Jugling...

Maybe it would be a nice idea for DE to release a mod with the balance of an older build, with all the bugs squished out and such... then we'll see how it works out..
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Lurker



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PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 8:46 am    Post subject: Re: Why doesn't Force have a projectile? Reply with quote

keep in mind that the older builds also had the old gravity...
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raptor
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Joined: 02 Sep 1999
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 9:24 am    Post subject: Re: Why doesn't Force have a projectile? Reply with quote

From what i hear from most people i talk to the old gravity implement wouldnt be all that bad.
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FlamingMonkey



Joined: 30 Jul 2002
Posts: 8397

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 10:17 am    Post subject: Re: Why doesn't Force have a projectile? Reply with quote

Quote:
But Jag's flk is easily faster than Force's landing cooldown! He gets to hit you with flk before you even get the chance to react, regardless of what you want to do.


...Or so you think. Keep in mind that they have to go through a block recovery, too. Even Jag's fLP can be caught in the landing counter. AI falls for it every single time without fail. The only moves I've seen that out-speed it is the Mantis slide and the Super Slide, probably a couple more Mantis attacks, too.
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Vuen



Joined: 31 Aug 1999
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 12:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Why doesn't Force have a projectile? Reply with quote

Quote:
keep in mind that the older builds also had the old gravity...


I've actually been playing LT 1860 lately and I like the old gravity better... Actually I like a lot of things about it better...
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Xaronth



Joined: 17 May 2003
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 12:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Why doesn't Force have a projectile? Reply with quote

Quote:
Quote:
Anyway the point is a Force still can't be aggressive towards a Jaguar. That combined with its attack system focused on specials and low armor to boot means the Jaguar is infinitely better off in the stun department.


I disagree with this...

right Xar? Wink


yes ghoul has a good point. ghoul and fm are one of the few people here that i have to actual think when fighting.

vuen, ive fought you before and regardless of counters you still dont take advantage of what force can do. ghoul and fm actually fight, like they're jags (ie, air moves to a some ground, facespam etc.).

i didnt mean to offend you vuen but thats the vibe i got. who knows, i havent even played ghoul or fm for ages these are just past experiences.
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Vuen



Joined: 31 Aug 1999
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 1:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Why doesn't Force have a projectile? Reply with quote

Maybe you're right. I started playing after both battlecasts when most people had already left BG, so I don't have much experience fighting good Jaguars. Insert other random excuses here. Ah well.
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eengoedemorgen



Joined: 30 Aug 2002
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 1:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Why doesn't Force have a projectile? Reply with quote

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Anyway the point is a Force still can't be aggressive towards a Jaguar. That combined with its attack system focused on specials and low armor to boot means the Jaguar is infinitely better off in the stun department.


I disagree with this...

right Xar? Wink


yes ghoul has a good point. ghoul and fm are one of the few people here that i have to actual think when fighting.

vuen, ive fought you before and regardless of counters you still dont take advantage of what force can do. ghoul and fm actually fight, like they're jags (ie, air moves to a some ground, facespam etc.).

i didnt mean to offend you vuen but thats the vibe i got. who knows, i havent even played ghoul or fm for ages these are just past experiences.


My reaction suffers from the Lag xaronth Wink that, and you're 1 league ahead of me... Wink
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Xaronth



Joined: 17 May 2003
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 1:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Why doesn't Force have a projectile? Reply with quote

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Anyway the point is a Force still can't be aggressive towards a Jaguar. That combined with its attack system focused on specials and low armor to boot means the Jaguar is infinitely better off in the stun department.


I disagree with this...

right Xar? Wink


yes ghoul has a good point. ghoul and fm are one of the few people here that i have to actual think when fighting.

vuen, ive fought you before and regardless of counters you still dont take advantage of what force can do. ghoul and fm actually fight, like they're jags (ie, air moves to a some ground, facespam etc.).

i didnt mean to offend you vuen but thats the vibe i got. who knows, i havent even played ghoul or fm for ages these are just past experiences.


My reaction suffers from the Lag xaronth Wink that, and you're 1 league ahead of me... Wink


Very Happy
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TheUnknownFactor



Joined: 01 Oct 2003
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 3:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Why doesn't Force have a projectile? Reply with quote

actually NightShadow is the hardest force match up for me, though granted, i havent fought ghoul and FM really much, but last i did i could do fairly good versus them.
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Endy



Joined: 31 Jul 2003
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 6:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Why doesn't Force have a projectile? Reply with quote

The real question is not "why doesn't force have a projectile". The REAL queastion is "why does the generate\throw system BLOW".

If force had more control over his vortexes and bombs he wouldn't need a projectile.

First of all, bombs need to track the target faster and have a charge up (like vortex).

Secondly, all throwables should have a better system of aiming than left hand = too long and right hand = too short.

Thirdly, the move sequence should be optimised to be all one motion. IE: generate AND throw. (if the user wants, they should still be able to charge them too) The force should not be standing around holding a vortex.


Finally, remeber that sometimes it takes 2 or 3 punches to get the ball "unstuck". This is a BUG thats been around form day 1.


There also needs to be a hard cap on the number of throwables force can have up at once. If this hard cap were in place, his throwables could be made MUCH more potent and still be balanced.

It's just that right now, they are too spammable, so they make them suck so they aren't overpowered when thrown in massive quantities.
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FlamingMonkey



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PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 7:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Why doesn't Force have a projectile? Reply with quote

I also think that the bombs need to track the opponent closer than they do. It's ridiculous to have something that follows the oponent and detonates when just outside the blast radius.
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