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Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate
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Vuen



Joined: 31 Aug 1999
Posts: 4968
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2005 5:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate Reply with quote

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
It was my first time online. Very Happy


OMG Vuen fought you? Vuen still plays??? I gotta fire the game up ASAP.


Uhh, no... I was just pointing out the fact that he's discussing the tier list after his first time being online.
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Wastelander5



Joined: 16 Oct 2005
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2005 9:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate Reply with quote

I ain't discussing it, I'm simply saying there's exceptions.

Which may or may not be irrelevant to say, but I felt like it.
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Endy



Joined: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 4079
Location: Lost within my own thoughts.

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 12:57 am    Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate Reply with quote

Quote:
Endy, you couldn't be much more wrong. Gargoyle has LP, which makes him the best HAR in the game.



Mantis and Warlord have combo opening moves that cannot be defeated with simple turtle tactics thus giving them a natural advantage versus all HARS.

All gargoyle, jaguar, force and pyros rely on solid high damage combos and defensive turtling tactics to win.

Chronos has several nice openers but his moves don't flow well and his armor is too low. To combo with him well takes weeks of practice and the final result is still gimp.

Katanas only saving grace is counter combos and the fact that is will bug out of most opponents combos after a few hits because of it's odd shape. That still barely gives it a fighting chance. Katana is buggy and unfinished.




Granted some HAR's are individually weak to other hars. Like Warlord is weak to jaguar and jaguar is weak to mantis for example. So mabye the argument exsists that Gargole has no natural weakness but that was not how I was structuring my heirarchy.
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Endy



Joined: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 4079
Location: Lost within my own thoughts.

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 1:02 am    Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate Reply with quote

Quote:
With warmup, not to mention a harder and longer to press key combo.


I also was not comparing difficulty of execution because it is irrelevant.

A Jaguar LK > RK slide (Where a jaguar player presses forward then releases it and immediatley presses LK > RK and slides forward through the whole move into the opponent) is one of the most difficult move timings to do. Yet any good jaguar player can do this on command to blocklock and stun an opponent.

It is part of the backbone of jaguars strategy (Total defensive turtling + LK stun slide on openings + suprise a.FRK at random hoping to catch opponent in a warmup frame)


Other hars (mantis, force and gargoyle come to mind) can preform heavy stunlocking spam combos without relying on intricate keypress timings.


The timing required to execute a move does NOT change the tier though. It simply means the HAR requires more skill and practice to play effectively.

The ultimate capability of the HAR remains unchanged.
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TheUnknownFactor



Joined: 01 Oct 2003
Posts: 13825
Location: Netherlands, Drenthe, Assen

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 11:08 am    Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate Reply with quote

Just try it out Endy, gargoyle LP is a better move than mantis RP.
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Discomb



Joined: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 4262
Location: Beijing, China

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 11:21 am    Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate Reply with quote

But no thrust.
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TheUnknownFactor



Joined: 01 Oct 2003
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Location: Netherlands, Drenthe, Assen

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 3:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate Reply with quote

You can walk, its very easy Wink
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Discomb



Joined: 31 Jul 2003
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 5:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate Reply with quote

But no thrust, AND with pushback. No good for stunlock.
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TheUnknownFactor



Joined: 01 Oct 2003
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 7:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate Reply with quote

you have no idea how good of a stunlock it is.
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Discomb



Joined: 31 Jul 2003
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 8:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate Reply with quote

Probably :p
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FlamingMonkey



Joined: 30 Jul 2002
Posts: 8397

PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 6:31 am    Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate Reply with quote

Gargoyle can chain any of his heavies after one another. That includes LK, his main thrust move.
Code:
do
  LK
  LP
 loop
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Discomb



Joined: 31 Jul 2003
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Location: Beijing, China

PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 7:40 am    Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate Reply with quote

But thats counterable.
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FlamingMonkey



Joined: 30 Jul 2002
Posts: 8397

PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 9:10 am    Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate Reply with quote

*sigh*

Code:
do
 LP
 (randomized pause)
 LK
 (randomized pause)
 loop

:sweat2:
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TheUnknownFactor



Joined: 01 Oct 2003
Posts: 13825
Location: Netherlands, Drenthe, Assen

PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 12:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate Reply with quote

Try this instead:
LP LP walk(while they're in the block animation) LP LP walk.
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Discomb



Joined: 31 Jul 2003
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 12:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate Reply with quote

OMG thats retarded but I can so see it working :p
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