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Discomb
Joined: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 4262
Location: Beijing, China
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 Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2004 5:16 am Post subject: Re: Evades |
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| Quote: | He has other means.
Range is his primary advantage... Freeze Crystals are his best bet.
And yeah, I do have a bias against Pyros. I'm most likely wrong in that area. |
Crystals dont spawn at all in lag, and may just be weird. I get by mostly without them, using only melee moves and catching evades with Tele Kicks. Sometimes I realize that I completely forget of the existance of the freezing special...
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TheUnknownFactor
Joined: 01 Oct 2003
Posts: 13825
Location: Netherlands, Drenthe, Assen
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| Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2004 8:16 am Post subject: Re: Evades |
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| Quote: | He has other means.
Range is his primary advantage... Freeze Crystals are his best bet.
And yeah, I do have a bias against Pyros. I'm most likely wrong in that area. |
Ofcourse there are things that make up for his lack of fast attacks, that doesn't mean it's not one of his main disadvantages. Magni, i agree 
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All errors in spelling and grammer are entirely by design in order to enrage those who have nothing left to add to the discussion and therefore seek superiority through personal attacks. |
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CloudFFVII
Joined: 23 Jul 2004
Posts: 360
Location: U.K.
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| Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 6:55 am Post subject: Re: Evades |
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Jaugar's pokes, I'm not saying they are the be all and end all. Sweet JEZUS you act like a move isnt worth using if it doesnt link into every other move that har has at their disposale. Nearly ALL of you base your 'eliteness' around your ability to do long combo's WHEN on the net can you ever get a full combo in unless your hosting.
Moves have OTHER uses than combos, For example Mantis, a well timed f,f,rk can EASILY throw someone into a hazard (and its strong enough to send someone all the way up the blades in the blast furnace.) [Jag leap can also send someone that far].
I admit that I had forgotten about Mantis' ground evades being rolls, I meant Jags rolls compared to other Har's 'hops'
Discomb already covered your 3rd point
You didnt really counter my argument about dropping Jaguar you just said that mantis is dropped aswell, Mantis is not dropped anywhere NEAR as much as Jaguar and mantis has hte problem of people falling out of his Super Slide (YES I KNOW BD has the same problems of missing)
Player, I dont use katana (if that was directed at me)
Mantis isnt unevadable just difficult to evade. After LK in a combo you can evade the a.lk but you will then be hit (by me) with a.flp/a.frp, With mantis' pitiful damage however your actually safer NOT evading and just letting the mantis add a few damage points on instead of resetting it by evading.
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Favourite Pilot: Reece
Favourite HAR: Pyros
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Discomb
Joined: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 4262
Location: Beijing, China
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| Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 10:17 am Post subject: Re: Evades |
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But then the whole thrill of surprising your oponent with a witty evade is gone!
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TheUnknownFactor
Joined: 01 Oct 2003
Posts: 13825
Location: Netherlands, Drenthe, Assen
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| Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 2:09 pm Post subject: Re: Evades |
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| Quote: | Jaugar's pokes, I'm not saying they are the be all and end all. Sweet JEZUS you act like a move isnt worth using if it doesnt link into every other move that har has at their disposale. Nearly ALL of you base your 'eliteness' around your ability to do long combo's WHEN on the net can you ever get a full combo in unless your hosting.
Moves have OTHER uses than combos, For example Mantis, a well timed f,f,rk can EASILY throw someone into a hazard (and its strong enough to send someone all the way up the blades in the blast furnace.) [Jag leap can also send someone that far].
I admit that I had forgotten about Mantis' ground evades being rolls, I meant Jags rolls compared to other Har's 'hops'
Discomb already covered your 3rd point
You didnt really counter my argument about dropping Jaguar you just said that mantis is dropped aswell, Mantis is not dropped anywhere NEAR as much as Jaguar and mantis has hte problem of people falling out of his Super Slide (YES I KNOW BD has the same problems of missing)
Player, I dont use katana (if that was directed at me)
Mantis isnt unevadable just difficult to evade. After LK in a combo you can evade the a.lk but you will then be hit (by me) with a.flp/a.frp, With mantis' pitiful damage however your actually safer NOT evading and just letting the mantis add a few damage points on instead of resetting it by evading. |
Yeah pathetic damage, too bad he does more damage in more stable combos then most other HARs. He can easily get a 180 damage combo in most pilots, and:
"Jaugar's pokes, I'm not saying they are the be all and end all. Sweet JEZUS you act like a move isnt worth using if it doesnt link into every other move that har has at their disposale. Nearly ALL of you base your 'eliteness' around your ability to do long combo's WHEN on the net can you ever get a full combo in unless your hosting."
That's your disability, i can do very decent combo's all much above 100 damage in servers upto ~ 125 ping in any HAR.
Night shadow can easily dish out insane combos even at 600ms ping.
YES, YOUR ELITENES DEPENDS ON YOUR ABBILITY TO COMBO IN NEARLY ANY HAR. You don't like it? too bad for you but its quite a simple fact, combos are simple and powerful. And if you're going to claim anything is near as good as Mantis, you're pushing yourself on combo area, since that's one of mantis main areas.
Chronos fLP IS pretty useles if you can't combo out of it. If you kill your combo with fLP, you lose any advantage you have inside your combo. If you use fLP OUTSIDE of combos, you're screwed whether it hits or not, fLP has longer cooldown and Chronos doesn't have fast attacks. Thus you fall into a combo/heavy attack.
So much for how useful attacks are that don't combo. (this is for practically any attack that doesnt combo well)
Mantis RK Slide can be combo'ed out of (with the right pilot), and it places you at an advantage. Most 'not comboing' attacks do NOT place you in advantage.
"[Jag leap can also send someone that far]"
No they cant, plus they have longer cooldown, less priority, and are slower, less range.
"I admit that I had forgotten about Mantis' ground evades being rolls, I meant Jags rolls compared to other Har's 'hops'"
That's pretty useles if you're going to compare Jaguar to mantis, isn't it?
"Discomb already covered your 3rd point"
Not really. He said that Jaguar has fragments out of Supers and that my point was irrelavant. My point wasn't irrelavant. I pointed out Mantis has better supers, and better fragments.
"You didnt really counter my argument about dropping Jaguar you just said that mantis is dropped aswell, Mantis is not dropped anywhere NEAR as much as Jaguar and mantis has hte problem of people falling out of his Super Slide (YES I KNOW BD has the same problems of missing)" I did counter the argument, and besides the current counter id like to point out that mantis has better ways of punishing the combo'er when he (the mantis) evades. Which HAR falls out of combos more is completely subjective to your combo, and not relavant at all since combos should be intuitive rather then standart, if you do not have abbilitys to adapt your combo to your enviroment, that's your issue.
"Mantis isnt unevadable just difficult to evade. After LK in a combo you can evade the a.lk but you will then be hit (by me) with a.flp/a.frp, With mantis' pitiful damage however your actually safer NOT evading and just letting the mantis add a few damage points on instead of resetting it by evading."
Mantis can be unevadable for a higher amount of hits, then finish it with an unblockable fragment, which can be followed by many 'unevadable' ground/air hits. If you do not consider something unevadable after LK, LK can be kept out until later in the combo, at which point ANY har would be stunned due to it being fragmented after the first ~130 damage, then continued upto ~ 150 damage before LK is used.
Mantis ONLY 'weaknes' is hit relatively low damage.
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All errors in spelling and grammer are entirely by design in order to enrage those who have nothing left to add to the discussion and therefore seek superiority through personal attacks. |
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Meowbeast
Joined: 07 Jul 2003
Posts: 736
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| Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2004 8:52 pm Post subject: Re: Evades |
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| Chronos flp was a part of my chronos spam. |
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Discomb
Joined: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 4262
Location: Beijing, China
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| Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 6:52 am Post subject: Re: Evades |
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| Quote: | | Chronos flp was a part of my chronos spam. |
I sympathise 
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