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Vuen
Joined: 31 Aug 1999
Posts: 4968
Location: Canada
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 Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2005 5:19 pm Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate |
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| Quote: | | Quote: | | Quote: | It was my first time online.  |
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OMG Vuen fought you? Vuen still plays??? I gotta fire the game up ASAP. |
Uhh, no... I was just pointing out the fact that he's discussing the tier list after his first time being online. |
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Wastelander5
Joined: 16 Oct 2005
Posts: 10
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| Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2005 9:58 pm Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate |
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I ain't discussing it, I'm simply saying there's exceptions.
Which may or may not be irrelevant to say, but I felt like it. |
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Endy
Joined: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 4079
Location: Lost within my own thoughts.
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| Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 12:57 am Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate |
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| Quote: | | Endy, you couldn't be much more wrong. Gargoyle has LP, which makes him the best HAR in the game. |
Mantis and Warlord have combo opening moves that cannot be defeated with simple turtle tactics thus giving them a natural advantage versus all HARS.
All gargoyle, jaguar, force and pyros rely on solid high damage combos and defensive turtling tactics to win.
Chronos has several nice openers but his moves don't flow well and his armor is too low. To combo with him well takes weeks of practice and the final result is still gimp.
Katanas only saving grace is counter combos and the fact that is will bug out of most opponents combos after a few hits because of it's odd shape. That still barely gives it a fighting chance. Katana is buggy and unfinished.
Granted some HAR's are individually weak to other hars. Like Warlord is weak to jaguar and jaguar is weak to mantis for example. So mabye the argument exsists that Gargole has no natural weakness but that was not how I was structuring my heirarchy.
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Endy
Joined: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 4079
Location: Lost within my own thoughts.
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| Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 1:02 am Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate |
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| Quote: | | With warmup, not to mention a harder and longer to press key combo. |
I also was not comparing difficulty of execution because it is irrelevant.
A Jaguar LK > RK slide (Where a jaguar player presses forward then releases it and immediatley presses LK > RK and slides forward through the whole move into the opponent) is one of the most difficult move timings to do. Yet any good jaguar player can do this on command to blocklock and stun an opponent.
It is part of the backbone of jaguars strategy (Total defensive turtling + LK stun slide on openings + suprise a.FRK at random hoping to catch opponent in a warmup frame)
Other hars (mantis, force and gargoyle come to mind) can preform heavy stunlocking spam combos without relying on intricate keypress timings.
The timing required to execute a move does NOT change the tier though. It simply means the HAR requires more skill and practice to play effectively.
The ultimate capability of the HAR remains unchanged.
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"I reject your reality, and substitute my own!" - Adam Savage (MythBusters)
"I don't know the key to success, but the key to failure is trying to please everyone." - Bill Cosby |
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TheUnknownFactor
Joined: 01 Oct 2003
Posts: 13825
Location: Netherlands, Drenthe, Assen
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| Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 11:08 am Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate |
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Just try it out Endy, gargoyle LP is a better move than mantis RP.
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All errors in spelling and grammer are entirely by design in order to enrage those who have nothing left to add to the discussion and therefore seek superiority through personal attacks. |
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Discomb
Joined: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 4262
Location: Beijing, China
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| Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 11:21 am Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate |
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But no thrust.
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TheUnknownFactor
Joined: 01 Oct 2003
Posts: 13825
Location: Netherlands, Drenthe, Assen
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| Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 3:51 pm Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate |
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You can walk, its very easy 
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Discomb
Joined: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 4262
Location: Beijing, China
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| Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 5:26 pm Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate |
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But no thrust, AND with pushback. No good for stunlock.
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TheUnknownFactor
Joined: 01 Oct 2003
Posts: 13825
Location: Netherlands, Drenthe, Assen
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| Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 7:32 pm Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate |
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you have no idea how good of a stunlock it is.
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All errors in spelling and grammer are entirely by design in order to enrage those who have nothing left to add to the discussion and therefore seek superiority through personal attacks. |
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Discomb
Joined: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 4262
Location: Beijing, China
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| Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 8:01 pm Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate |
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Probably :p
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FlamingMonkey
Joined: 30 Jul 2002
Posts: 8397
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| Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 6:31 am Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate |
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Gargoyle can chain any of his heavies after one another. That includes LK, his main thrust move.
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Discomb
Joined: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 4262
Location: Beijing, China
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| Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 7:40 am Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate |
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But thats counterable.
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FlamingMonkey
Joined: 30 Jul 2002
Posts: 8397
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| Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 9:10 am Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate |
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*sigh*
| Code: | do
LP
(randomized pause)
LK
(randomized pause)
loop |
:sweat2: |
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TheUnknownFactor
Joined: 01 Oct 2003
Posts: 13825
Location: Netherlands, Drenthe, Assen
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| Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 12:26 pm Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate |
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Try this instead:
LP LP walk(while they're in the block animation) LP LP walk.
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Discomb
Joined: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 4262
Location: Beijing, China
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| Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 12:39 pm Post subject: Re: Ultimate Warrior - Aggressive Debate |
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OMG thats retarded but I can so see it working :p
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